Tim Blair

I think that Australian officer(?) you quoted a few days ago said it all. Just make 'em glow in the dark.

The war was wrong. Bring back Saddam!

It's all about the ooooiiiiiiiiillllll!

Solomon Islands- NO BLOOD FOR SAND

Did this guy really say that Libya, Syria and Iraq are anti-semitic?

This guy was a director of the Central INTELLIGENCE Agency?

Anti-semitic meaning they hate Jews. That, whether you like it or not, is what anti-semitic today means. Don't be an ass.

Craig if you prefer Judenhass you can use that.

The West needs to prepare for a long, bitter stuggle. It will require sacrifice and blood. It means we need to stay focused and not get distracted by the annoying buzzing of the Left, And we need to be particularly on alert in the final stages of this conflict, when a wounded, dying enemy lashes out with his last effort hoping to inflict a lethal strike and take as many as he can with him.

Embarrassing when you spell your own name wrong! "This ain't no party; this ain't no disco; this ain't no fooling around." This is the real thing and it isn't going to be pretty. Our enemies are serious; they're determined; they're ruthless. They are hard men with cold hearts; they'll kill you without hestiation. Just like they did to Danny Pearl.

Regardless of what you decide anti-semitic means the fact remains that the hated Arab is semitic.

A lazy term used by lazy people.

And Libya, Syria are Judenhass-holes.

"Or we could just sit around like idiots and argue about African uranium."

How about we leave the left to complain about African uranium while we move on and plot the next regime change?

By the way Monkeybrain what makes you think I hate Jews. Is it laziness, or just small minded stupidity?

Craig, you're inviting a backlash from anti-semantics. Not condoning it, of course...

No worries Anjam.

Just making a point about the often absurd use of the term anti-semitic. Like I said, lazy.

I got the response I was looking for.

"Bush lied; people died!"

... I swear I'm going to go on a murderous rampage next time somebody mentions anything remotely along those lines to me again...

What will it take to get the opposition to realise this is a problem that needs to be delt with NOW, rather than after the shit hits the fan again?

What will it take to get the opposition to realise this is a problem that needs to be delt with NOW, rather than after the shit hits the fan again?

I'm afraid that the answer, depressingly, is "for the shit to hit the fan again".

Just making a point about the often absurd use of the term anti-semitic. Like I said, lazy.

And in the course revealing your ignorance. The term "antisemitic" was developed because it's more "scientific" and "polite" sounding than "Jew hatred". You might also want to consult a dictionary; the word's definition SPECIFICALLY applies to Jews.

I got the response I was looking for.

So you admit you were Jew-baiting.

But these people have no interest in dealing with this problem. Thus the delaying action called YellowCakeGate. The problem these people have is called extended adolescence; they have no interest in dealing with this problem because they have no interest in growing up.

The term was developed? Where? In a word lab?

I can actually think of a more current meaning of the term anti-semitic by reading some of the posts on this site.

As for Jew-baiting.

Lazy, Lazy, Robert.

If I ever run off to a dictionary to try and prove someone wrong please shoot me.

Tongue Boy,

Like most adolescents, these guys think they're smarter than everyone else. That's the main reason they find Bush so irksome.

I have spent almost two years listening to various liberals' arguments that we should sit tight and play nice, etc., and start with the mea culpas. It's obviously a means for them to feel control over a situation in which they know they have little control, but much less useful than the guy in Tulsa who keeps on eye on the resevoir in case them Al Kaydas decide to go after Tulsa next. (Who knows? If Tulsa's the easier target....) The liberals know deep down inside that our enemies want to kill us, kill them, kill their mothers, kill their children, kill their daddies, kill their cousins, kill their special friends, kill their kittens and puppies, kill their cute li'l hamsters too. It's weird to be in New York, where half the city has Stockholm Syndrome.

craig - you're being pedantic. Most reasonably educated people know that anitsemitic means the hatred of Jews. The word wasn't developed in a lab, but through the normal process by which any word becomes part of a language. There was a need for a, as someone pointed out, more polite term for the rabid hatred of Jews. Like it or not, that word is antisemitic. It isn't a matter of laziness; that's pure silliness. How about commenting on the subject matter? The war in which we are currently engaged.

Craig is not being pedantic, he's being silly. The OED shows a 1935 usage by the Economist and a 1941 usage by J.S. Huxley. In both cases antisemitic specified hosility or opposition to the Jews. Further, the OED notes that the word semitic had previously evolved to mean Jewish specifically.

Craig - I quote the Merriam-Webster online :"Anti-semitism: hostility toward or discrimination against Jews as a religious, ethnic, or racial group."

If you want to retire the word,come up with something better and convince others to adopt it.In the meantime,Woolsey's comment was totally accurate.

tongue boy and zsazsa, i confess, you've figured us lefties out. our dislike of bush obviously has nothing to do with, you know, political differences, and instead is all about our "extended adolescence" [thanks for figuring out what the heretofore mysterious x-factor is called, by the way].

also, tim blair concedes defeat on yellowcake-gate, issues "idiots" epithet as a parting shot.

Craig can't be bothered with actually lifting a finger to look up sources -- that's "lazy." Whereas, sitting on your ass listening to the voices that filter in through your tinfoil hat is the correct way to do things. I'd like to try to write a research paper that way.

Where does he concede defeat on yellowcake-gate, adam?

I'm sorry Nobody, but it is plain lazy to suggest that Arabs can be anti-Semitic. Anti-Israel maybe.

Let's just say I speak out about the Israeli occupation of the West Bank and Gaza. Does this make me anti-Semitic?

Of course not. But some of your brethren would label me anti-Semitic. This is lazy.

By war, do you mean the invasion of Iraq?

If you are conducting a war on Islamic terrorism then, what a stupid move.

If it is for strategic reasons as I believe it was, then I can understand the rationale. Although I don't agree.

If you mean for the liberation of the Iraqi people, don't make me laugh.

I think my wife is going to unplug me.

Craig,
I didn't say that you hated Jews. You complained that anti-semitism didn't mean jew hatred, so I gave you the original term anti-semitism replaced. If you perfer to think that anti-israeli covers hatred of all Jews, so be it.

Craig,

Are you suggesting that Arabs, by definition, cannot be anti-Jewish? At most, they can be anti-Israel?

I have a dictionary, too, Craig. I just don't feel the need to brag about it.

"Semite" includes Arabs, "anti-" does mean against, but "Anti-Semitism" is not only common parlance for being anti-Jewish, it is in fact the meaning of the word, and any attempt to atomize the word so you can reassemble it into something else is just so stupid.

"July 20, 1969 - Man walks on the Moon"

No, jackhole, we walked on a Moon, not the Moon. There are literally dozens of Moons in the Solar System. Titan, Io, Ganymede...be more specific!

Depends on what the meaning of "the" is.

Frightened lefty diverts discussion into pedantic word definition.

Film at 11.

"but it is plain lazy to suggest that Arabs can be anti-Semitic. Anti-Israel maybe."

Which is why Mein Kampf has been a best-seller in the West Bank. Why the "Protocols of Zion" was shown on broadcast TV. Why imams refer to Jews as descendents of pigs and monkeys. Why the "blood libel" continues to be printed in Arab newspapers.

"Lazy": You use that word a lot. I do not think it means what you think it does.

By doing a little searching with Google, I learned that the term "Antisemitic" was coined in 1879 by Wilheim Marr, an antiJewish, antiChristian, racist "theoretician".

Joseph Telushkin wrote: "...the word 'antisemitism' was created by an antisemite, Wilhelm Marr [in 1879]. Marr's intention was to replace the German word Judenhass (Jew-hatred) with a term that would make Jew-haters sound less vulgar and even somewhat scientific....Throughout history, antisemitism has been directed against [the religion of] Judaism and its values. ...Until about 1800, the societies in which Jews lived were generally piously Christian or Muslim, and so antisemitism focused on Jewish concepts of God and law. In the last two centuries, during which nationalism became a dominant value in the Western and Arab worlds, antisemitism increasingly focused on the Jews' peoplehood and nationhood."

J. Telushkin, "Jewish Literacy: The Most Important Things to Know About the Jewish Religion, Its People and Its History," William Morrow, (1991).

The statement by Rabbi Michael Melchior, Deputy Foreign Minister of the State of Israel, delivered at the World Conference against Racism, Racial Discrimination, Xenophobia and Related Intolerance, September 3, 2001, is particularly instructive on the subject of antisemitism.

‘Semitic’ refers to a group of languages, including Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic, Babylonian, Assyrian and Ethiopic. The term ‘anti-Semitism´ is directed only towards Jews. It is a modern European linguistic formulation for Jew-hatred.

Wilhelm Marr introduced the term in 1879. Marr founded the ‘League of Anti-Semites’ in an effort to form a political movement that widened hatred of Jews from religion to race, and replaced the words ‘Jew and ‘Judaism’ with ‘Semite’ and ‘Semitism’.

Thanks, Anabel and Ernie G. I never knew the etymology of "anti-semitism" and just figured it had changed its original meaning over time, like "villain" or "fuckwit". Now I have another factoid to combat idiots with!

scott h.: I believe that craig is simply inventing his own definitions for words. He probably believes that "lazy" means "able to find online dictionaries."

Hostility toward or prejudice against Jews or Judaism.
Discrimination against Jews.
American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.

Anti-Semitism \An`ti-Sem"i*tism\, n. Opposition to, or hatred of, Semites, esp. Jews. Source: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.

antisemitism
anti-Semitism n : the intense dislike for and prejudice against Jewish people
Source: WordNet ® 1.6, © 1997 Princeton University

Three, only one mentions the possibility it could apply to Arabs, and even that one makes it clear that the primary meaning is hatred of Jews. Can anyone find a dictionary that defines it differently?

This might explain why some seem to think "The British Government has learned..." means "I have positive proof that..."

Sorry for interrupting the diversion into: words ..meanings and origins.

To quote poster nobody important (above):

"The West needs to prepare for a long, bitter stuggle. It will require sacrifice and blood. It means we need to stay focused and not get distracted by the annoying buzzing of the Left, And we need to be particularly on alert in the final stages of this conflict, when a wounded, dying enemy lashes out with his last effort hoping to inflict a lethal strike and take as many as he can with him."

I agree 100%. The people who want to conquer the West are not people we can make treaties with. We don't have anything they want. They want to create a paradise on Earth using their view of Islam as a guide. If you don't want to join them, you'll be killed.

Since they don't occupy one country it will be more difficult to defeat them. It will be a long war. A war that isn't always waged with guns.

Off the etymology of hate words but - most news outlets are reporting Saddam's monster-like sons as dead or captured. Also the Eiffel Tower is on fire.

So here's to dancing on your enemies' graves.

I think what Craig did was to read a discussion on NRO's "The Corner" a few weeks ago which pointed out the orignal definition of "semitic" and there was a brief discussion. So ole lazy-ass Craig, armed with this knowledge, and being the devoid of original thought left-wing meatwhistle he is decided to shift the focus of a discussion adults were having, by displaying how his vast knowledge is so superior to anything we right wing whack jobs have at our disposal. Whenever the left is confronted with facts, shift the focus with something like "no you are". Such is the world of the morons, psycopaths, and mental defectives of the left. If you'll excuse me, I want ot listen to what Jessie Lynch has to say right now, she about to speak.

Adam,

Although I'm inclined to agree with ZsaZsa's InstaPsych analysis of the reasons behind the Left's Pavlovian response to YellowCakeGate, I must point out my comment made no analysis of lefty aversion to Bush, merely my own layman's InstaPsych analysis of certain responses to YellowCakeGate. I make no warranties for my InstaPsych analysis as I've no psych training, know no psychologists or psychiatrists, have never played one on TV and, in fact, can't remember the last time I saw an actor play one on TV.

On the other hand, I know bulls**t when I smell it as my olfactory sense works just fine, thank you very much. Extended adolescence or no, the nose knows and this nose smells something pungent coming from the general direction of some putative adults who have their short-pants twisted in a knot and foam dripping from their lips, raging that Emperor Bushitler's stormtroopers, er, Coalition forces actually accomplished another step in the rollback of Islamofascist terror. It just plain stinks that some folks would rather the other side be wrong than support something constructive, oh, like, I dunno know, protecting Western Civ from Islamofascism.

But that's an American for ya'. Always wanting to actually accomplish something rather than send the problem to the EUnuch Committee Launch Center, where it's fired into space to join a comet-load of other problems that circle the Sun and emerge in public consciousness every 76 years.

Two more confirmed guerillas dead: the Hussein Boys, Uday and Qusay. This is the fate of our enemies. Sic Semper Tyrannus!

I would like to see the definition of "line drive" supplied by one who thinks that "antisemitic" must necessarily be defined as "the definition of 'anti' + the definition of 'semitic'"

2 Down, 2 to go (Daddy Hussein and OBL).

Where'd Andrew's 1969 thing come from? Just thought I would point out that it is the moon. Just as it is the sun. The other rocky bodies orbiting planets are referred to as Satallites, as other huge balls of fusion heated gas are 'stars'. Sun & Sol, Moon & Lunar seem to be complety interchangeable.

As for the topic at hand, isn't it sad (or disgusting if not so common?) that the left's policies require simply clenching our jaw and waiting for the other party to join us at the table whilst they slaughter our comrades. It seems to me as though we have limited time to establish the middle eastern countries. Once their oil runs out, they'll return to being impoverished and require great aid to turn around.

just my 2 cents.

Merely pointing out how overanalyzing common language for overly narrow or overly broad meanings to make some profound "point" leads to meaninglessness.

We are loathed for freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of press, the way we treat women?

Nice one, but you're wrong CIA. These factors pale into insignficance when you look at America's track record on foreign affairs, intervention in government and civil disputes, trade and military presence. These reasons are more likely to incite violence than a bunch of Muslim's viewing our freedom of speech with jealousy.

Hi, I'm Craig. I'm going to start posting comments very similar to Craig's, but over time, will become less idiotarian. Then when Craig gets sick of being confused with me, he'll go away.

No doubt he'll get very angry at my using his identity, and when he accuses me of impersonating him, I'll accuse him of impersonating me.

Loads of fun!!

And Bon Scott as well . . .

Tim Blair
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So I'm banned then Tim?

If so, weak. Very very weak.

But I'm Bon Scott!

Here's an article which I feel is spot on to why the Islamofascists hate us so much, written by Steven Den Beste.

http://denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2002/09/Whoisourenemy.shtml

Be sure to read the follow-on article, linked at the bottom - this outlines how we'll probably fight the war in the long term, and should clear up any misunderstandings you may have from the the first article. Note, though that both of these articles were written several months before Gulf War II.

http://denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2002/09/Arabtraditionalism.shtml

Interesting, nonetheless.

Marty,
Late to post but always ready to respond, we call it "Going Postal" I'll bring the belt feed high volume armament you get the beer and hoagies.

Fake Craig you can use my name anytime you want if you don't have the guts integrity to use your own.

Defeats the purpose of having a web discussion though.

As for Poo in the Hat I don't know what you are talking about. I thought it was common knowledge that Arabs are Semitic.

With regard to your dictionary specials, I'm afraid these references refer to anti-semitism from a European point of view. Arabs are Semitic, hence the absurdity of saying that Arabs are anti-semitic.

I am pleased it has promoted so much discussion.

Now get ready with those dictionaries.

Real Craig, I am also interested in web discussions because I want to have guts integrity like you.

That's why I would never call you a retard, and especially not from a European point of view, mostly because there is no such fucking thing as a Dictionary of the European Language.

But English dictionaries normally hold some clues about the commonly perceived meanings of words and combinations of words. I also would never suggest that your inability to even partially concede a inconsequential point in the face of substantial evidence is a very good indicator that you are, in fact, in the fight just to hear the crowd roar. It's just that everyone else is lazy!

Oh, Craig, Craig, Craig. Dudes like you make it so easy, all one has to do is let you talk.

But I'm the real Craig. And I'm just covering up for the fact that I don't like jews (unless they're Barbara Streisand), but don't want to be called anti-semitic.

Craig's notion that Arabs cannot be antisemites is one I have been hearing ever since Arab antisemitism first emerged. Among the many apologias for antisemitism this is the most ignorant and lazy. Arabs have never at any time considered themselves to be 'semites.' Few of them know what the word means (it is a linguistic term coined in the 19th century). When the Nazis propagated antisemitism in the Arab world they made it entirely clear to the Arabs that 'semite' in this connection means 'Jew.' Now the Arab countries are the word center of antisemitic propaganda in its most rabid form, as bad as Nazi Germany, which was the source of it. Several earlier messages have pointed out to Craig that he is inexcusably confusing two different meanings of 'semite,' but he seems impervious to new information.

I'm anti-Craig. But I'm wondering, can Craig be anti-Craig? And can the fake Craig be anti-realCraig but not anti-selfCraig? Either from a semetic or European viewpoint, for that matter?

My, oh, my, what interesting topic drift!

Random_Prose:

"Solomon Islands- NO BLOOD FOR SAND"

Gasp! Wherever will we get our micro-chips?!

I'm Craig... and so's my wife!

I'd just like to join the Craig thread to say that Craig is either 11, or sillier than a bagful of arseholes, or on second thoughts, both.
The English dictionary defines what "English"words mean, and there isn't a separate worldview to be had on that. Nor can you decide what words ought to mean.

I'm all in favour of using Jew-hater for people who indulge in this kind of baiting.

I believe they prefer the term "Jew-eschewin' douchebags."

I'll vote Craig's way if he agrees to fix the rest of the OED while he's at it.

If you were all paying attention in Sunday School, you would remember the story of Noah.
Noah had three sons, Shem, Ham and Japheth.
The “Shemites” or “Semites” are the supposed descendants of Shem (Sem in Greek).

According to the Bible, Abraham was a descendant of Shem.
Abraham begat two sons, Ishmael and Isaac.
Traditionally, the Arabs descend from Ishmael, and the Hebrews (and thus Jews) descend from Isaac. So Arabs and Jews are both 'semites' and ‘half-brothers’.

Etymology is not a great deal of help in working out what a word currently means.

Paste, pasta, pastry, pasty and pâté all derive from an ancient Greek word meaning “barley porridge”

>Etymology is not a great deal of help in working out what a word currently means.

Nope; that's generally decided by looking at a dictionary.